Posted by Q on September 14, 1998 at 16:46:58:
Joe, Honey, Star Trek is a TV series, several tv series as a matter of fact. My favorite is DS9. Now, TV is kinda limited. They kinda have to use human actors. Heck The Great Bird of the GAlaxy had a rule, that you have to be able to see actors face.
Now, who knows what wonderful forms life on other planets might take. Heck, communication may also be a huge problem. Look at it like this. Whales and dolphins use sonar like we use vision. Their brains are evolved to process the information. We have to make machines to do it for us. Think of some species that doesn't even have to use numbers because their brains process information in a completely different way then human brains do. There are infinate possibilities for other forms of life. Who's to say we won't find a hyperintelligent shade of the color blue somewhere. Of course, I don't think that would sell to the advertisers very well.
Posted by Joe Martin on September 15, 1998 at 07:04:18:
The point you were making at the time was to let the kids have some fun. SETI, introducing a dice roll into the curriculum with regards to the establishment of life anywhere was letting the kids have some fun in your opinion. I would propose that Seti is doing more than just letting the kids have some fun. What they are proposing to the children is that abiogenesis is not a miracle and that it is probably duplicated throughout the universe on massive scales.
That life is nothing more than chemical reactions that only requires a bit of luck to come together in the right "mix". That this "mix" becomes animated in some form or another and the evolutionary process takes over because the animation of the chemical mix will react to the surrounding conditions and evolve. Something the rock next door won't do. Now here’s the SETI kicker. They want to instill these ideas into young children because they think that intelligence is dependent on their realizing these processes and that any other form of knowledge about life just leads to delusion and superstition. Whether Seti is accurate is not up for discussion as far as the curricula is concerned. It all makes good scientific sense. Here's an example of something that doesn't make good scientific sense to the curricula. That God has it all under control. That there is a purpose to life and that each and everyone of us are unique and special in God's eye. Here's a reply to Facts and Faith, a periodical from the Reason's to Believe Ministries regarding abiogenesis and the chance proposal that SETI wants introduced into the curricula.
". . . I appreciated Deanna Overstreet's As I See It column, 'Chance Revisited' [vol. 9, no. 1]. Creationists often argue that science makes a god out of chance, and that if one believes in modern cosmology, abiogenesis, or natural selection, one has necessarily assigned God's role to chance, leaving no room for Him in the creative process. Ms. Overstreet exposes this false dichotomy. Although it sounds paradoxical, God is capable of working His will and purposes through random processes. I can only speculate as to how He manages this, but as Ms. Overstreet demonstrates, it appears to be a biblical principle. . . ."
Steve, Tucson, Ariz.
It would seem to me Q that while the children are having fun they are being sent home with a clear message that God, if there even is one, is a materialist rooted in physical processes. The biblical principle that Steve speaks of is not a scientific principle so if it conflicts with scientific principles then the Bible has to be a lie. Now Q, I'm all for letting the kids have their fun and games but let's be honest here. This particular curricula is designed to make liars out of parents that teach biblical principles. In a world where all manner of morality is allowed because we haven't got a clue what it is anymore or even whether it should exist, the parents are being told that it is their responsibility to guide their children in the face of onslaught. You really have to be quick to catch the significance but what right does science have in establishing the likelihood of life on another planet and that it comes about purely the result of a dice game? The children are given no other possibility other than the one that SETI presents as scientific fact. All other possibilities are presented as superstition and probably lies.
Back to Star Trek. What scientific evidence is there that precludes evolution from being directed soley towards the humanoid life form wherever it exists? What scientific evidence is there that life evolved on another planet will be completely unrecognizable but just as intelligent? Why would the shade of blue become any more intelligent than the shade of red? Sounds like you'd rather be blue shifted than red shifted.
Q- Heck, communication may also be a huge problem. Look at it like this. Whales and dolphins use sonar like we use vision. Their brains are evolved to process the information. We have to make machines to do it for us.
J- Where does the truth of this claim come from? You mean they want to convince you that machines are necessary don't you. If you depend on machines then you must depend on the makers of the machines. Since we only use 10% of brain capacity you have no idea of what God had in store for us do you? But you could always convince yourself that you "need" their help. They could also convince you that you can't do without it. Economics works this way. Before anyone asks what I mean by "they" again I'll explain. They, represent the force that seeks to eliminate the individual human dignity that God has declared to be present in mankind and on which the Founding Fathers established America. This force exists regardless of scientific evidence to the contrary. Because without it the truth will never be known. You can call him the devil if you like.
Q- There are infinite possibilities for other forms of life.
J- Yes, but not an infinite amount of possibilities for mankind.